Oh yeah, I'm also reminded of how penguins have been known to prostitute themselves, meaning that prostitution isn't a choice.

"I don't think trying to devise a genetic predisposition to homosexuality reverts it to an illness any more than genetic causes make brown hair or blue eyes an illness."

YOU don't, of course. You don't think people burn in hell because of it, either. To you it isn't that much different than hair color. I think you are using your rose colored glasses if you think that a great many people wouldn't consider it a unwanted characteristic, if not a birth defect.

"If I was hungry and had a choice between a sandwich and a chair, I would choose to eat the sandwich. But how much of a choice was that?"

Some would say that homosexual acts are the equivalent of using a chair for a sandwich...

Well, I.. I guess I'd better not get too serious about this subject. It is humorous and 'sadly gay' all at once. However, I would like to give reference here to a website for homosexual penguins who want 'out' of that lifestyle. www.//birdbrain lodge chic.org is a site where all penguins can feel welcome. Founded by the famous a-sexual studies biologist, Just (pronounced 'juust') A. Lukin, Ph. D. EFG, it has helped many of these wandering fellows get back on the ball. As many of you know, it is the 'dad' penguin who haches the egg in a fete of un-matched devotion to furthering its species. Because of global warming this sacrifice is being played 'down' (no pun intended) by the older male penguins, citing the shorter periods of sub-zero weather that the young bucks have to endure. The flighless birds have more than enough humiliation to endure from other birds, let alone their older generation. Dr. Lukin assures us that unlike the human homosexuals, whom the 'gay' penguins have studied and make reference to in their defence of their stance..or shortened stance as the case might be, are not to be confused with the gay birds who are really not gay at all. "They are just being picked on too much." says Dr. Lukin."They grow out of it and move on to normalcy in most cases. Those who won't 'grow-up' so to speak, usually wind up in zoos or warmer,more remote environs. I do hope this puts the right tone on things here. By the way, has anyone ever eaten a penguin? They are delicious. Taste like cold, very cold chicken

By the way, has anyone ever eaten a penguin?

this is way too good an opening to pass on...i hope i got enuff strength to force myself to hit the submit button while i still can.

So what happens when the penguins come out to their families? Do they get thrown to the seals?

I think it is the Orcas that eat Penguins, not seals.

But thanks for the laugh!

this is way too good an opening to pass on...i hope i got enuff strength to force myself to hit the submit button while i still can.

I was thinking the same thing.  But Decorum got the better of me,

I think you are using your rose colored glasses if you think that a great many people wouldn't consider it a unwanted characteristic, if not a birth defect.

Any one who would consider homosexuality a genetic defect would be a hypocrite if they didn't also use the term for left-handedness, or any other genetic trait that is a minority in the population.

"Any one who would consider homosexuality a genetic defect would be a hypocrite if they didn't also use the term for left-handedness, or any other genetic trait that is a minority in the population."

I wasn't aware that people considered left-handedness a sin. I'm not aware of any WASPy families that are ashamed for their neighbors to find out their kid is left handed.

You're telling me the people who quietly shuttle their princesses off for nosejobs and quicky abortions wouldn't LOVE to know ahead of time if a kid was going to be gay? I think you are acting more naive than you really are.

Any one who would consider homosexuality a genetic defect would be a hypocrite if they didn't also use the term for left-handedness, or any other genetic trait that is a minority in the population.

Unfortuately there are a lot of people out there like that.  You may call them any name in the book, but I doubt even you would not acknowledge they exist, and they would do just that.

I wasn't aware that people considered left-handedness a sin. I'm not aware of any WASPy families that are ashamed for their neighbors to find out their kid is left handed.

Neither you nor I had mentioned sin or religion until this point. The discussion was entirely about genetics, and a trait that is not in the majority of the population has to be considered a genetic defect. Therefore, if homosexuality is a genetic defect, left-handedness would have to be too.

You're telling me the people who quietly shuttle their princesses off for nosejobs and quicky abortions wouldn't LOVE to know ahead of time if a kid was going to be gay? I think you are acting more naive than you really are.

Unfortuately there are a lot of people out there like that. You may call them any name in the book, but I doubt even you would not acknowledge they exist, and they would do just that.

I'm not telling you anything about what certain people will and will not do. I'm making analogous comparisons between one situation and another to perhaps get someone to see how ridiculous it is to consider one a defect. I'm aware of the world in which I live, and of all its imperfections. I will not stand by, however, and think that they have to remain imperfections forever.

Any one who would consider homosexuality a genetic defect would be a hypocrite if they didn't also use the term for left-handedness, or any other genetic trait that is a minority in the population.

Or color-blindness or having six fingers on each hand instead of five? What makes one a defect and not the other?

Probably the same thing that makes homosexuality not a choice, but polygamy and promiscuity a choice, even though all three traits are found in animals.

Probably the same thing that makes it wrong to belittle transexuals for the surgery they have, but not people who have other surgeries (such as the women on the Swan or Michael Jackson), even though in both cases, it's to fix one of "God's mistakes."

You're telling me the people who quietly shuttle their princesses off for nosejobs and quicky abortions wouldn't LOVE to know ahead of time if a kid was going to be gay? I think you are acting more naive than you really are.

I've wondered about this question. If a person's "sexual orientation" is genetic, and it could be tested during pre-natal tests, would aborting a fetus because of being gay be considered a right of "choice" to be respected, or a "homophobic" act to be abhored???

I'm not telling you anything about what certain people will and will not do. I'm making analogous comparisons between one situation and another to perhaps get someone to see how ridiculous it is to consider one a defect. I'm aware of the world in which I live, and of all its imperfections. I will not stand by, however, and think that they have to remain imperfections forever.

I think both of us perhaps saw you trying to deny reality, not expressing the truth.  I dont disagree, and I doubt Baker does as well.  But we know they exist.  Hell, in china they abort girl babies due to the one baby rule.  And the last thing anyone would say was a defect is the female gene.

You analogy is true.  But then we do have to live with all people.  And many would not agree with it.

I've wondered about this question. If a person's "sexual orientation" is genetic, and it could be tested during pre-natal tests, would aborting a fetus because of being gay be considered a right of "choice" to be respected, or a "homophobic" act to be abhored???

I think that is a whole nother blog in itself!  And a very good question.

"Neither you nor I had mentioned sin or religion until this point. The discussion was entirely about genetics, and a trait that is not in the majority of the population has to be considered a genetic defect. Therefore, if homosexuality is a genetic defect, left-handedness would have to be too."

Yet sin and religion is one reason of many that a genetic characteristic might be deemed unwanted. Your left-handed example would be darned fitting in many Islamic nations, wouldn't it? In humans, AND penguins, genetic traits are graded by social interaction.

You brought up homosexuality as natural state. I'm just saying that there is a HUGE downside to the idea, even more so than "choice", in my opinion.

Gay people state that they couldn't choose as though it is an insta-win arguement against anyone who disagrees with their lifestyle. I think they underestimate the genetic vanity of the species...